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We Need to Stick Together!

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  • R redacted@infosec.pub

    People (note that I'm saying people, not whatever authoritarian figure you simp for) are celebrating this, from Brazil, to Colombia, and in Venezuela. Get a grip.

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    socialism_everyday@reddthat.com
    schrieb zuletzt editiert von
    #63

    Hahahaha Lula da Silva and Gustavo Petro, the democratically elected prime ministers of both countries, are authoritarian figures. Average European lmfao

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    • W wltr@discuss.tchncs.de

      I’m not sure on the federation thing (I just don’t understand how it would work for the EU), but I’m 100% sure when Russia would become a set of independent states (and not a federation it pretends it is), global terrorism would just go incredibly less, within one day, literally. They contribute to global chaos quite a lot. Especially backed by PRC and the US (administration) being a Russian puppet.

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      alcoholicorn@mander.xyz
      schrieb zuletzt editiert von
      #64

      So when the US trained and armed terrorists all over the world under every previous administration, was it still due to orders to the Kremlin? Or did the Kremlin order the Trump administration to do the thing we've been doing for a century?

      Putin: Agent Trump, we need you to genocide Muslims, overthrow governments in South America, prepare for war with communists, and oppress brown people back home.

      Trump: Don't tell me how to do my fucking job.

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      • S socialism_everyday@reddthat.com

        Hahahaha Lula da Silva and Gustavo Petro, the democratically elected prime ministers of both countries, are authoritarian figures. Average European lmfao

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        redacted@infosec.pub
        schrieb zuletzt editiert von
        #65

        Then maybe obviously I meant it as "authority", not "dictatorship"? What people want versus what the higher ups want. Police is also authority. That word has multiple definitions my dude. Context matters.

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        • W wltr@discuss.tchncs.de

          That’s ironic, in a way, that there’s no Ukraine among those flags. Adding it would actually make the EU much stronger. A real life modern war experience (literally the most experienced country on the planet), plus the biggest country in Europe. With quite a large international community of emigrants (due to harsh historical circumstances). Plus experience filtering Russian propaganda, which is quite strong and influential (for those unaware).

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          foo@feddit.uk
          schrieb zuletzt editiert von
          #66

          Putin also knows how strong Europe would be with Ukraine, which is likely why he is so hell bent on destabilising the bloc and taking Ukraine for himself. The sad part is it seems to be working for him. Even if he doesn't get Ukraine the way he hoped, the campaign to destabilise the bloc is worrying.

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          • M menas@lemmy.wtf

            Yep, get stronger to face threat, that how imperialism work
            Fuck those states, everyone of them

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            foenkyfjutschah@programming.dev
            schrieb zuletzt editiert von
            #67

            so you submit to the empire that rules you…

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            • R redacted@infosec.pub

              Then maybe obviously I meant it as "authority", not "dictatorship"? What people want versus what the higher ups want. Police is also authority. That word has multiple definitions my dude. Context matters.

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              socialism_everyday@reddthat.com
              schrieb zuletzt editiert von
              #68

              Authority is a different word from authoritarian, and you clearly used the latter. You're the one bringing up which country does or doesn't support Maduro, so don't try to scurry out of it.

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              • F foenkyfjutschah@programming.dev

                so you submit to the empire that rules you…

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                menas@lemmy.wtf
                schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                #69

                No, I'm organized against without the support or supporting others

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                • S socialism_everyday@reddthat.com

                  Authority is a different word from authoritarian, and you clearly used the latter. You're the one bringing up which country does or doesn't support Maduro, so don't try to scurry out of it.

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                  redacted@infosec.pub
                  schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                  #70

                  Please re-read my comment. I don't know what else to tell you.

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                  • R redacted@infosec.pub

                    Please re-read my comment. I don't know what else to tell you.

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                    socialism_everyday@reddthat.com
                    schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                    #71

                    There is no definition of "authoritarian" as "authority" in common English language, you're trying to redefine words. The word you mean is "authority figure" or "authoritative".

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                    • alsaaas@lemmy.dbzer0.comA alsaaas@lemmy.dbzer0.com

                      OK so you are a evronationalist militarist, nice to know there are so many right-wingers on Lemmy now... ( ,,⩌'︿'⩌,,)

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                      noja@sopuli.xyz
                      schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                      #72

                      Ironic comment because almost all anti-EU people in Europe are far-right.

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                      • kittenzrulz123@lemmy.dbzer0.comK kittenzrulz123@lemmy.dbzer0.com

                        Most eurolibs would happily allow European imperialism and justify it by arguing if they didn't do it someone else would

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                        noja@sopuli.xyz
                        schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                        #73

                        Is this "European imperialism" in the room with us right now?

                        kittenzrulz123@lemmy.dbzer0.comK 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                        • ethanol@pawb.socialE ethanol@pawb.social

                          Saying Europe is a US vassal state is a bit much lol. Europe is one of the biggest economic powers in the world together with the US and China. They all export and import a lot of wares between each other and thus depend on each other. The tariff deal the EU got with the US wasn't that great and the leader of the European commission, Ursula von der Leyen, got some backlash because of that but I guess her tactic was to just appease Trump so they will have more time to transition away from the US in some areas. On the other hand that deal reduced some very annoying tariffs on steel and car parts, so it was partially successful.

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                          resonosity@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                          schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                          #74

                          transition away from the US

                          And transition to China 🙂

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                          • W wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz

                            How much is your socialism gonna help anybody when a fascist state overthrows you because you don't have a military?

                            Funding a defense force isn't inherently right-wing militarism; it's a practical necessity in the world we live in. Its primary function is as a deterrent to potential invaders, it only goes into kinetic operations when its function as a deterrent fails. All the more reason to maintain a strong military.

                            Peace is more likely when your adversaries know they won't stand a chance against you.

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                            resonosity@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                            schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                            #75

                            you don't have a military

                            The only leftist ideology that advocates against an active military is anarchism. Anarchists prefer spontaneous militias that activate as soon as another state acts on them. Obviously there are downsides to this practice as 1) gathering up a militia and organizing them can take time away from defending against outside oppressors, which can jeopardize defense in general, and 2) gathering up a militia of normal folk in a society means they won't be actively trained in conducting warfare effectively, or at least not as much as another state that does have an active military - this also represents a lower hand which can again jeopardize defense in general.

                            Marxist-Leninist communists believe that an active military that trains its population and performs drills regularly is the most suitable defense against capitalist states, since they have their own military doing the same.

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                            • eugenevdebs@lemmy.dbzer0.comE eugenevdebs@lemmy.dbzer0.com

                              "Look someone had to rape every single brown person and steal their stuff. So why not Europe? They swore they don't do that anymore."

                              kittenzrulz123@lemmy.dbzer0.comK This user is from outside of this forum
                              kittenzrulz123@lemmy.dbzer0.comK This user is from outside of this forum
                              kittenzrulz123@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                              schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                              #76

                              Oh yeah and we know they totally stopped after WW2, yup no neocolonialism or backing foreign military occupations. Just look at how Europe is treating the Palestinian occupation, they sent them unlimited weapons very strongly as an act of condemnation. Look their feelings are hurt and that's close enough to real action.

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                              • N noja@sopuli.xyz

                                Is this "European imperialism" in the room with us right now?

                                kittenzrulz123@lemmy.dbzer0.comK This user is from outside of this forum
                                kittenzrulz123@lemmy.dbzer0.comK This user is from outside of this forum
                                kittenzrulz123@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                                schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                #77

                                No but its in northern Africa and the Middle East, I have been to Palestine personally. Those starving children don't care that a couple of EU members have strongly worded statements when the weapons flow freely.

                                I don't care what eurolibs have to say, their actions speak significantly louder

                                eugenevdebs@lemmy.dbzer0.comE 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                                • R resonosity@lemmy.dbzer0.com

                                  you don't have a military

                                  The only leftist ideology that advocates against an active military is anarchism. Anarchists prefer spontaneous militias that activate as soon as another state acts on them. Obviously there are downsides to this practice as 1) gathering up a militia and organizing them can take time away from defending against outside oppressors, which can jeopardize defense in general, and 2) gathering up a militia of normal folk in a society means they won't be actively trained in conducting warfare effectively, or at least not as much as another state that does have an active military - this also represents a lower hand which can again jeopardize defense in general.

                                  Marxist-Leninist communists believe that an active military that trains its population and performs drills regularly is the most suitable defense against capitalist states, since they have their own military doing the same.

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                                  wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz
                                  schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                  #78

                                  Tell that to the person being "unapologetically socialist" whom I responded to.

                                  Anarchists can't even organize a voting bloc or a civil sector, and they think a militia will spontaneously activate when needed? Oh please.

                                  For the record, I am somewhere on the left of the spectrum. I believe both social democracy and democratic socialism have their merits. I'm definitely not an ML, for various reasons including I believe they're too authoritarian and I find them insufferable.

                                  But I also believe that modern social democracies such as are found in western and northern Europe have societies and ways of life that are worth defending, even if that means fighting for them. With the threat looming to the east, I find it imperative for Europe to fund a strong military coalition/alliance.

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                                  • sunshine@piefed.caS sunshine@piefed.ca
                                    This post did not contain any content.
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                                    mattw03@lemmy.ca
                                    schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                    #79

                                    Still 2 vs 1.

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                                    • S socialism_everyday@reddthat.com

                                      There is no definition of "authoritarian" as "authority" in common English language, you're trying to redefine words. The word you mean is "authority figure" or "authoritative".

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                                      redacted@infosec.pub
                                      schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                      #80

                                      https://fiveable.me/key-terms/ap-psych-revised/authoritarian-figures

                                      Having authority over most of the subjects means being an authoritarian figure amongst those subjects. How much of an authoritarian a leader is, is another question. When I said "authority versus people", again, I quite clearly meant voices of people versus voices of prime ministers and presidents who probably have different dealings going on.

                                      The word "figure" plays a rather important role, as I never said "authoritarians".

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                                      • F f04118f@feddit.nl

                                        I want a Europe that is strong and stands for European values.

                                        If the USA also follows those values we work together.

                                        If they don't, we can do it without them.

                                        But only if we in Europe are united!

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                                        0x0@lemmy.zip
                                        schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                        #81

                                        European values.

                                        That's a myth.
                                        There may be baseline values like, dunno, humanity, other than that you can't have broad common values east to west north to south, countries are too different.

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                                        • R redacted@infosec.pub

                                          People (note that I'm saying people, not whatever authoritarian figure you simp for) are celebrating this, from Brazil, to Colombia, and in Venezuela. Get a grip.

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                                          0x0@lemmy.zip
                                          schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                          #82

                                          Get a grip.

                                          Get better sources.

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