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  3. Today we're sharing the first in a series of three posts from our leadership team, starting with @mellifluousbox discussing our mission, and priorities for 2026.

Today we're sharing the first in a series of three posts from our leadership team, starting with @mellifluousbox discussing our mission, and priorities for 2026.

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  • nitrml@tyrol.socialN nitrml@tyrol.social

    @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

    1. Mastodon's code already includes a setting which server admins can enable to set a minimum age for their server, which will ask for a date of birth to be entered during sign-up. The date of birth is not stored, only checked once. This has been part of Mastodon's code since multiple months now: https://github.com/mastodon/mastodon/pull/34150

    2. What they say in the blog is that they will audit the GmbH's own servers, which probably includes an audit of this feature.

    3. The interesting stuff is what that "working group" will come up with.

    mark@mastodon.fixermark.comM This user is from outside of this forum
    mark@mastodon.fixermark.comM This user is from outside of this forum
    mark@mastodon.fixermark.com
    schrieb zuletzt editiert von
    #48

    @nitrml @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic Age verification won't, of course, stop someone from setting up their own server.

    ... which, at least regarding the federation choices this little node will be making... Is enough of its own age-gating process that we will welcome all nodes regardless of age of their admins. 😉

    benroyce@mastodon.socialB 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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    • mark@mastodon.fixermark.comM mark@mastodon.fixermark.com

      @nitrml @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic Age verification won't, of course, stop someone from setting up their own server.

      ... which, at least regarding the federation choices this little node will be making... Is enough of its own age-gating process that we will welcome all nodes regardless of age of their admins. 😉

      benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
      benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
      benroyce@mastodon.social
      schrieb zuletzt editiert von
      #49

      @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

      which is great of you, thank you

      ...and your stance is dependent upon the legalities of your jurisdiction

      so people who do enable the age verification are not assholes, they just don't want their govt coming after them

      and your own govt may change its mind, then you have to think about it

      the problem is govt

      not mastodon admins

      mark@mastodon.fixermark.comM lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL 3 Antworten Letzte Antwort
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      • benroyce@mastodon.socialB benroyce@mastodon.social

        @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

        which is great of you, thank you

        ...and your stance is dependent upon the legalities of your jurisdiction

        so people who do enable the age verification are not assholes, they just don't want their govt coming after them

        and your own govt may change its mind, then you have to think about it

        the problem is govt

        not mastodon admins

        mark@mastodon.fixermark.comM This user is from outside of this forum
        mark@mastodon.fixermark.comM This user is from outside of this forum
        mark@mastodon.fixermark.com
        schrieb zuletzt editiert von
        #50

        @benroyce @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic All of this is very good insight.

        1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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        • benroyce@mastodon.socialB benroyce@mastodon.social

          @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

          My understanding is that they will be making the software updates available to other servers that are also forced to comply or get shut down. Is my understanding wrong? It could be

          lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
          lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
          lukefromdc@kolektiva.social
          schrieb zuletzt editiert von
          #51

          @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

          I for one will not remain on any server that asks for ID, treating such a thing as being a shutdown.If I have to move everything to the darknet I can and I will.

          Single-user Mastodon servers hosted at home could make age verification useless.Torified federation if supoortes could prevent ISP blocking, as can mesh networking in built-up areas.

          Even if this goes all the way to shuting down things like Signal, Matrix and other decentralozed altetnatives will be very hard to shut down.

          Then there is Diaspora: I don't know a whole lot about it but it's supposed to work like Facebook UI wise but with distributee hosting on the backend

          benroyce@mastodon.socialB 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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          • benroyce@mastodon.socialB benroyce@mastodon.social

            @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

            which is great of you, thank you

            ...and your stance is dependent upon the legalities of your jurisdiction

            so people who do enable the age verification are not assholes, they just don't want their govt coming after them

            and your own govt may change its mind, then you have to think about it

            the problem is govt

            not mastodon admins

            lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
            lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
            lukefromdc@kolektiva.social
            schrieb zuletzt editiert von
            #52

            @benroyce @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic Shutting down is also an option. I could not in good conscience run anything that asks for ID. If I owned a store I would refuse to carry age restriced products for the same reason.

            benroyce@mastodon.socialB 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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            • lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL lukefromdc@kolektiva.social

              @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

              I for one will not remain on any server that asks for ID, treating such a thing as being a shutdown.If I have to move everything to the darknet I can and I will.

              Single-user Mastodon servers hosted at home could make age verification useless.Torified federation if supoortes could prevent ISP blocking, as can mesh networking in built-up areas.

              Even if this goes all the way to shuting down things like Signal, Matrix and other decentralozed altetnatives will be very hard to shut down.

              Then there is Diaspora: I don't know a whole lot about it but it's supposed to work like Facebook UI wise but with distributee hosting on the backend

              benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
              benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
              benroyce@mastodon.social
              schrieb zuletzt editiert von
              #53

              @LukefromDC @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

              which is all fine and good, because you're talking tactics not emotional grand standing

              what you won't do therefore is attack some admin of a server of thousands or more for doing what they *have* to do so the govt doesn't knock on their door

              lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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              • benroyce@mastodon.socialB benroyce@mastodon.social

                @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

                which is great of you, thank you

                ...and your stance is dependent upon the legalities of your jurisdiction

                so people who do enable the age verification are not assholes, they just don't want their govt coming after them

                and your own govt may change its mind, then you have to think about it

                the problem is govt

                not mastodon admins

                lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                lukefromdc@kolektiva.social
                schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                #54

                @benroyce @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic The PR only adds an option to ask age, not to use a 3ed party AI verificstion "service" or read an ID. By itsrlf that's a nothingburger but I would still turn it off legal or otherwise on any server I ran.

                Note that birthdays are dangerous in the hands of an atacker, so never enter your real one for any account anywhere. Let the account go if challenged

                benroyce@mastodon.socialB 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                • lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL lukefromdc@kolektiva.social

                  @benroyce @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic Shutting down is also an option. I could not in good conscience run anything that asks for ID. If I owned a store I would refuse to carry age restriced products for the same reason.

                  benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                  benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                  benroyce@mastodon.social
                  schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                  #55

                  @LukefromDC @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

                  what do you think about my post above asking for a credit card?

                  it achieves the same effect, and no one is getting a credit card without id. no server is getting your id and the security hassle with that, and you're not revealing your id anymore than it already has been

                  the big benefit: with your cc already attached to your profile, donating to your server becomes a breeze. and more people should be doing that

                  lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                  • benroyce@mastodon.socialB benroyce@mastodon.social

                    @LukefromDC @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

                    which is all fine and good, because you're talking tactics not emotional grand standing

                    what you won't do therefore is attack some admin of a server of thousands or more for doing what they *have* to do so the govt doesn't knock on their door

                    lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                    lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                    lukefromdc@kolektiva.social
                    schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                    #56

                    @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

                    No, I would attack the government and steer people to servers out of their reach. An admin hassled one too many times by cops might even need to move their own account to one if the cops go after their hosting

                    benroyce@mastodon.socialB 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                    • benroyce@mastodon.socialB benroyce@mastodon.social

                      @LukefromDC @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

                      what do you think about my post above asking for a credit card?

                      it achieves the same effect, and no one is getting a credit card without id. no server is getting your id and the security hassle with that, and you're not revealing your id anymore than it already has been

                      the big benefit: with your cc already attached to your profile, donating to your server becomes a breeze. and more people should be doing that

                      lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                      lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                      lukefromdc@kolektiva.social
                      schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                      #57

                      @benroyce @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic Some do not have or want credit cards and will simply use other servers.

                      There is no way any regime can shut down access to every non-agr verification compliant server. Limits on federation woulf just split the fediverse into two networks which would inevitanly be bridged back together.

                      FL cannot even stop Pornhub: they just block conmections from FL IP addresses and gladly take Tor and VPN traffic

                      benroyce@mastodon.socialB 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
                      0
                      • lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL lukefromdc@kolektiva.social

                        @benroyce @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic The PR only adds an option to ask age, not to use a 3ed party AI verificstion "service" or read an ID. By itsrlf that's a nothingburger but I would still turn it off legal or otherwise on any server I ran.

                        Note that birthdays are dangerous in the hands of an atacker, so never enter your real one for any account anywhere. Let the account go if challenged

                        benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                        benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                        benroyce@mastodon.social
                        schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                        #58

                        @LukefromDC @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

                        i yearly enjoy the services that sometimes say happy birthday to me...

                        on the fake birthday i've been entering since forever

                        🤭

                        salixsericea@mastodon.socialS 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                        • lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL lukefromdc@kolektiva.social

                          @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

                          No, I would attack the government and steer people to servers out of their reach. An admin hassled one too many times by cops might even need to move their own account to one if the cops go after their hosting

                          benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                          benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                          benroyce@mastodon.social
                          schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                          #59

                          @LukefromDC @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

                          again that's all fine and good

                          but if you're asking a server to shut down with thousands of accounts when people can just enter a fake birthday it's far too dramatic

                          effective resistance is not about purity

                          lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                          • ariarhythmic@ohai.socialA ariarhythmic@ohai.social

                            @Mastodon @mellifluousbox If Mastodon implements age verification, we leave.

                            lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                            lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                            lukefromdc@kolektiva.social
                            schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                            #60

                            @ariarhythmic @Mastodon @mellifluousbox There will ALWAYS be noncompliant servers run by people who never travel to the US , the EU, the UK, or Austrailai. Also ones run by crews who know how to obfuscate ownerahip and get offshore hosting.

                            That's where you will also find me-on noncompliant servers

                            1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                            • lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL lukefromdc@kolektiva.social

                              @benroyce @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic Some do not have or want credit cards and will simply use other servers.

                              There is no way any regime can shut down access to every non-agr verification compliant server. Limits on federation woulf just split the fediverse into two networks which would inevitanly be bridged back together.

                              FL cannot even stop Pornhub: they just block conmections from FL IP addresses and gladly take Tor and VPN traffic

                              benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                              benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                              benroyce@mastodon.social
                              schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                              #61

                              @LukefromDC @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

                              you mean tor and VPN providers that spy on the people who use it because anyone using that it is flagging their activity as sensitive?

                              tor was started at the us naval research laboratory for dissidents in countries unfriendly to the usa

                              you think they don't have enough exit nodes to see what is going on?

                              and mastodon needs support

                              i'd almost (i said almost) support the idea of mandatory ccs on sign up with or without id laws

                              lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                              • benroyce@mastodon.socialB benroyce@mastodon.social

                                @LukefromDC @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

                                again that's all fine and good

                                but if you're asking a server to shut down with thousands of accounts when people can just enter a fake birthday it's far too dramatic

                                effective resistance is not about purity

                                lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                                lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                                lukefromdc@kolektiva.social
                                schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                #62

                                @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron Some servers are much smaller and can provide their users wirh migration tips.

                                This is what blackblogs.org did when running a US based anarchist wordpress hosting server got too dangerous: they shut doen, and steered people like myself to noblogs.org and other non-US alternatives, plus guides to moving content over. I didn't lose any content at all

                                benroyce@mastodon.socialB 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                                • lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL lukefromdc@kolektiva.social

                                  @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron Some servers are much smaller and can provide their users wirh migration tips.

                                  This is what blackblogs.org did when running a US based anarchist wordpress hosting server got too dangerous: they shut doen, and steered people like myself to noblogs.org and other non-US alternatives, plus guides to moving content over. I didn't lose any content at all

                                  benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                                  benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                                  benroyce@mastodon.social
                                  schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                  #63

                                  @LukefromDC @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

                                  great

                                  would you characterize yourself as the average mastodon user? or more broadly, the average social media user?

                                  most people want to sign onto a server, browse, and post

                                  that's it

                                  you can't go after them for that, people don't have the bandwidth or time for the hassles

                                  and we can't become a tiny whisper of a cryptic fringe to adhere to some unnecessary purity test

                                  lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                                  • benroyce@mastodon.socialB benroyce@mastodon.social

                                    @LukefromDC @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

                                    you mean tor and VPN providers that spy on the people who use it because anyone using that it is flagging their activity as sensitive?

                                    tor was started at the us naval research laboratory for dissidents in countries unfriendly to the usa

                                    you think they don't have enough exit nodes to see what is going on?

                                    and mastodon needs support

                                    i'd almost (i said almost) support the idea of mandatory ccs on sign up with or without id laws

                                    lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                                    lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                                    lukefromdc@kolektiva.social
                                    schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                    #64

                                    @benroyce @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic .onion access bypasses exit nodes enrirely. If Tor gets compromised dozens of nations find their intelligence services lose covert communication except by direct radio or sattelite. If civilian traffic is blocked or driven off, spy traffic then instantly stands out.

                                    Too many armies need Tor to kill it

                                    benroyce@mastodon.socialB 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                                    • lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL lukefromdc@kolektiva.social

                                      @benroyce @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic .onion access bypasses exit nodes enrirely. If Tor gets compromised dozens of nations find their intelligence services lose covert communication except by direct radio or sattelite. If civilian traffic is blocked or driven off, spy traffic then instantly stands out.

                                      Too many armies need Tor to kill it

                                      benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                                      benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                                      benroyce@mastodon.social
                                      schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                      #65

                                      @LukefromDC @mark @nitrml @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic

                                      .onion doesn't use exit nodes but it uses rendezvous nodes

                                      and nobody wants to kill tor, the intelligence services love it

                                      the foolishness is people who think something built by the us govt is perfectly anonymous

                                      it *is* anonymous. to most every other entity

                                      lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                                      • benroyce@mastodon.socialB benroyce@mastodon.social

                                        @LukefromDC @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

                                        great

                                        would you characterize yourself as the average mastodon user? or more broadly, the average social media user?

                                        most people want to sign onto a server, browse, and post

                                        that's it

                                        you can't go after them for that, people don't have the bandwidth or time for the hassles

                                        and we can't become a tiny whisper of a cryptic fringe to adhere to some unnecessary purity test

                                        lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                                        lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                                        lukefromdc@kolektiva.social
                                        schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                        #66

                                        @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

                                        That means they will find servers that fit their needs, just as folks in my position find servers that fit our needs. Mastodon is NOT like Twitter or FB wirh a single server farm and one set of rules for all.

                                        benroyce@mastodon.socialB 1 Antwort Letzte Antwort
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                                        • lukefromdc@kolektiva.socialL lukefromdc@kolektiva.social

                                          @benroyce @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

                                          That means they will find servers that fit their needs, just as folks in my position find servers that fit our needs. Mastodon is NOT like Twitter or FB wirh a single server farm and one set of rules for all.

                                          benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                                          benroyce@mastodon.socialB This user is from outside of this forum
                                          benroyce@mastodon.social
                                          schrieb zuletzt editiert von
                                          #67

                                          @LukefromDC @meowki @iju @ariarhythmic @mellifluousbox @Mastodon @MastodonEngineering @Gargron

                                          zero argument

                                          and if you make the services you talk about user friendly enough that the average social media user can point and click and zero hassle, even better

                                          until then, some servers are stuck in unfriendly districts

                                          and that's not their fault

                                          the govt is at fault

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