While we do #Denmark #Danmark #USA #Greenland #Arctic drama, don't forget the #Inuit, the people who live there

@grumble209 @TCatInReality @eswag @Pepijn

You're using the word "sociopath" like it means "poopiehead"

And you're avoiding the point

If there is an election that doesn't effect you, but will negatively effect someone else, you won't vote and that negatively effected group can go to hell

That's entitlement

You won't act because how you feel about yourself is more important than real world effects

That's the sum total of your precious "principles": self-serving self-regard

@benroyce @TCatInReality @grumble209 @eswag @Pepijn

A sane voting system would resolve the misgivings about voting (e.g, ranked voting).

Most of my life I had not voted in presidential elections and thought much like the quote you refer to. I said I'd vote when I wanted to vote *for* someone, not against another.

DJT changed all that - I'll vote against pure evil any day.

But still, I'd be far more motivated to vote if I could vote my conscious (3rd party) without throwing my vote away.

@jmcclure @benroyce @TCatInReality @grumble209 @eswag @Pepijn the whole throw away vote is insane concept. A third party is very necessary in a bipartisan prone system. Keeps them both in check. Imagine another party aside from the dems keeping Donald in check and also keeping dems in check. Now imagine how fast a no confidence vote could throw him right out on his ass on the slightest misstep.

@benroyce @TCatInReality @eswag @Pepijn You can draw your line where ever you want to draw it.

I'll continue to vote, but not for candidates on the wrong side of my line. I have other options - so do you. My life is too short to waste trying to unfuck the DNC without having billionaires of dollars to spread around.

@grumble209 @TCatInReality @eswag @Pepijn

"I have other options"

what other options?

you vote and you matter or you don't and you don't

what other options are there?

@benroyce @TCatInReality @eswag @Pepijn My Washington state 2024 ballot had 10 candidates for US president. How many did yours have?

https://www.sos.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2024-09/Voters%20Pamphlet%202024%20-%20Edition%2021%20-%20Pend%20Orielle.pdf

@grumble209 @TCatInReality @eswag @Pepijn

do you really need me to explain to you the value of a third party vote in an FPTP voting system?

are you trolling?

if you vote third party, you might as well vote for trump

this is your great principles? not understanding your own voting system and bumbling into helping fascism?

@benroyce @TCatInReality @eswag @Pepijn I understand that the DNC and the GOP have so gerrymandered the states that voting outside of those two camps is unlikely to win. I understand the Electoral College predates political parties, and has been abused by partisans since its inception. We've had 235 years to unfuck this, but apparently we've always had more important things to do. God knows no other nation uses such an archaic system like we do.

Maybe we'll change it after Trump dies. But the DNC has shown no appetite for meaningful change. I guess we'll see.

@grumble209 @TCatInReality @eswag @Pepijn

so 3rd party only serves as a spoiler in FPTP

perot gave us clinton

nader gave us bush2

ranked choice is creeping in to the country, which will give us viable 3rd party

the GOP in 2024 made a hardline stance against it so the democrats remain the only path forward. many corporatist dems oppose it, but some support it: it's how we got mamdani in NYC

so we show up in the primaries and support dem candidates that support RCV

@grumble209 @TCatInReality @eswag @Pepijn

"Maybe we'll change it after Trump dies"

we won't ever change it, with your attitude

you need to fucking show up and act tactically with your vote

it's the only way

but apparently you have the entitlement to sit around and deliver uninformed cynicism on the topic

must be nice

@benroyce @TCatInReality @eswag @Pepijn I'm happy to help!

We just need a Dem candidate who supports RCV and isn't a sociopath.

Which probably means we're fucked, but lets be optimistic!

@eswag @benroyce @Pepijn

"the Dems are a holding pattern before the next nosedive."

So wisely said. The Democratic Party has structural defects that cannot be overcome. If there are elections next November, at best we can only expect another repeat of the previous administration.

@grumble209 @TCatInReality @eswag @Pepijn

agreed, with one caveat:

the worst dog shit democrat is still not fascism happy MAGA

so even if the democrat is the most spineless chuck schumer shitbag, you act tactically, rather than sitting things out and watching us go to fascism

it's not a fucking romance

it's tactics in a game, to hold the line if not proceed to better, so you at least can go for better tomorrow, rather than putting out fires for decades

@benroyce @grumble209 @TCatInReality @Pepijn

"even if the democrat is the most spineless chuck schumer shitbag"

Or better yet, use that Dem as a firing solution for your next primary campaign. Seriously, US folks, why did Schumer even get to stand last time round? That was your error right there.

@benroyce @grumble209 @TCatInReality @Pepijn

"even if the democrat is the most spineless chuck schumer shitbag"

Or better yet, use that Dem as a firing solution for your next primary campaign. Seriously, US folks, why did Schumer even get to stand last time round? That was your error right there.

@TCatInReality @grumble209 @eswag @Pepijn

people who don't #vote love the "lesser evil" quote by #HannahArendt

the problem:

the quote is from her 1964 essay “Personal Responsibility Under Dictatorship”

she is describing life under #fascism, where people have no real choice

it has nothing to do with choice in #democracy

nonvoters are misusing her quote

if Hannah were commenting on #USA #elections today, she would say "fuck! vote, you entitled assholes!"

(she would say it nicer than that)

@Pepijn

if someone didn't vote, they are absolutely without a leg to stand on on anything

this is where i place all my anger as an american

all their toxic idealism, all their mindless cynicism: it's nothing more than pure unadulterated entitlement and weak stupid excuses

absolutely infuriates me

we *have* to vote to defeat this abomination. there are no excuses

@davevolek @benroyce @Pepijn

I think we can afford more optimism. Inserting real democrats has been done via primaries, against the wishes of the Dem party and their bankrollers.

Without voting in the primaries like it's the last good thing you ever get to do, I agree, the electorate will deliver another "burn it all down" vote in due course. Assuming they get to keep voting.

@eswag @benroyce @Pepijn

We can be optimistic. But we should be realistic. The new Democrats might be sidelined. Or they might to co-opted into the neoliberal agenda. There is a risk in assuming the Democratic Party is the only way to save the USA.

And we know very little about these overly ambitious people. They might create a wonderful image that they care about the common people, but very few of us understand their true motives.

Building a new democracy is hedging our bet.

@davevolek @benroyce @Pepijn

If you see a better option, I'm all ears.

I'm describing something that has been done, it's not speculation. It's certain to work if it is done on a big enough scale and we don't get wiped out by a catastrophe.