This is how The American Civil War 2.0 begins.

@randahl The two unanalysed assumptions in your post are (1) that civil war is avoidable at this point given that the regime has already started one by kidnapping and murdering innocent citizens, and (2) that the regime has not already ended democracy.

Both of these assumptions are palpably false, however much trouble liberals may have accepting reality. Any one of the resisters the Black Panthers are protecting here could be next on the ICE hit list. They've begun brutalising children.

Kids.

@randahl
You are wrong on this one, Randahl. I understand your point but you are wrong.

This is how The American Civil War 2.0 begins.

While it is expected that people would react this way, sadly this is EXACTLY what Stephen Miller and Trump wants. All the regime is waiting for is for the first ICE officer to be gunned down by guys like these, so they can invoke the insurrection act, send in the tanks, and end democracy.

This is NOT the way.

Defeat Trump decisively in the midterms and throw him in jail. That has a real chance of working — zero violence involved.

@ApostateEnglishman I am furious with what the regime is doing — the people they are hurting; the killing of Renee Good.

But this does not change the fact, that if the American people picks up weapons against the regime now, everything goes sideways. Every court case, every protest, every collection of evidence — everything is replaced with violence, and thousands will die.

This is handing the regime the justification it needs to send in the tanks.

This is not the way.

@randahl So do you think if everyone remains calm, unarmed and defenseless, the regime will respect this? That it won't simply keep escalating its own violence until it has the excuse it needs to deploy the military, whatever that may take?

Is there some theoretical threshold of murdered and/or illegally detained civilians past which you would accept that however this ends, it isn't going to end peacefully?

Where is your red line?

@helava I understand why people would love what he says.

But strategically this works against democracy.

This is all feeling, zero thought.

@virtuous_sloth here are the two options:

A: Wait it out, let 10 months pass, defeat Trump decisively in the midterms, and only if Trump does not respect the result, pick up arms. Few people die in 2026.

B: Pick up arms, give Trump an excuse for sending in the tanks. Thousands die in 2026.

Please elaborate why I am wrong when claiming that A is better than B.

@ApostateEnglishman this is certainly difficult to quantify, because any killing is one too many.

But would you not agree, that in all likelyhood, fewer will die if the American people wait it out and defeat Trump in the midterms, as compared to picking up arms and Trump sending in the tanks?

Remember, Black Panthers killed police officers and civilians back in the day. If that starts happening now, you are on the direct path to civil war and thousands will die.

@ApostateEnglishman this is certainly difficult to quantify, because any killing is one too many.

But would you not agree, that in all likelyhood, fewer will die if the American people wait it out and defeat Trump in the midterms, as compared to picking up arms and Trump sending in the tanks?

Remember, Black Panthers killed police officers and civilians back in the day. If that starts happening now, you are on the direct path to civil war and thousands will die.

This is how The American Civil War 2.0 begins.

While it is expected that people would react this way, sadly this is EXACTLY what Stephen Miller and Trump wants. All the regime is waiting for is for the first ICE officer to be gunned down by guys like these, so they can invoke the insurrection act, send in the tanks, and end democracy.

This is NOT the way.

Defeat Trump decisively in the midterms and throw him in jail. That has a real chance of working — zero violence involved.

@virtuous_sloth here are the two options:

A: Wait it out, let 10 months pass, defeat Trump decisively in the midterms, and only if Trump does not respect the result, pick up arms. Few people die in 2026.

B: Pick up arms, give Trump an excuse for sending in the tanks. Thousands die in 2026.

Please elaborate why I am wrong when claiming that A is better than B.

@randahl I think that your (and others’) assumption that the Regime will ever allow free and fair midterms to happen is hopium. If they lose, every single one of them is going to have to face consequences for their actions. I despair at the escalation, but given the craven spinelessness of the Congress to stop this (7 Democrats just voted to keep funding ICE), it is unsurprising that the people who are being harmed and killed no longer believe that their so-called “democracy” is going to save them - it never has. @ApostateEnglishman

WTF @ChrisHolladay? Could someone talk these guys down before they flush democracy down the drain?

(Video above)

@randahl @ChrisHolladay It probably won't be these guys. Trump's regime will send in agent provocateurs to start the violence.

@Lynnd @randahl @ApostateEnglishman

I'm kind-of with Randahl on this. Although I think if it looks like they'll lose, the Republicans will engineer an excuse to cancel the elections, I'm also inclined to think non-violent protest and economic pressure represent the better strategy until that cancellation, because I think that political outrage - along with the intervening economic deterioration - will give clarity to many people and unite the opposition. It might even split the Republicans.

@virtuous_sloth here are the two options:

A: Wait it out, let 10 months pass, defeat Trump decisively in the midterms, and only if Trump does not respect the result, pick up arms. Few people die in 2026.

B: Pick up arms, give Trump an excuse for sending in the tanks. Thousands die in 2026.

Please elaborate why I am wrong when claiming that A is better than B.

This is how The American Civil War 2.0 begins.

While it is expected that people would react this way, sadly this is EXACTLY what Stephen Miller and Trump wants. All the regime is waiting for is for the first ICE officer to be gunned down by guys like these, so they can invoke the insurrection act, send in the tanks, and end democracy.

This is NOT the way.

Defeat Trump decisively in the midterms and throw him in jail. That has a real chance of working — zero violence involved.

This is how The American Civil War 2.0 begins.

While it is expected that people would react this way, sadly this is EXACTLY what Stephen Miller and Trump wants. All the regime is waiting for is for the first ICE officer to be gunned down by guys like these, so they can invoke the insurrection act, send in the tanks, and end democracy.

This is NOT the way.

Defeat Trump decisively in the midterms and throw him in jail. That has a real chance of working — zero violence involved.

This is how The American Civil War 2.0 begins.

While it is expected that people would react this way, sadly this is EXACTLY what Stephen Miller and Trump wants. All the regime is waiting for is for the first ICE officer to be gunned down by guys like these, so they can invoke the insurrection act, send in the tanks, and end democracy.

This is NOT the way.

Defeat Trump decisively in the midterms and throw him in jail. That has a real chance of working — zero violence involved.

This is how The American Civil War 2.0 begins.

While it is expected that people would react this way, sadly this is EXACTLY what Stephen Miller and Trump wants. All the regime is waiting for is for the first ICE officer to be gunned down by guys like these, so they can invoke the insurrection act, send in the tanks, and end democracy.

This is NOT the way.

Defeat Trump decisively in the midterms and throw him in jail. That has a real chance of working — zero violence involved.