Age verification is spreading like cancer.

nocci@punk.cyber77.de

@jathanasiou@mastodon.social

The issue is that Niemöller's poem specifically addresses the Holocaust and Nazi persecution - the systematic murder of millions. Using it for age verification, no matter how concerning those policies are, trivializes the Shoah.

Age verification absolutely raises serious privacy and surveillance concerns that deserve strong opposition. But we can make that case without invoking genocide. The slippery slope to authoritarianism exists, but comparing a digital rights issue to the Holocaust weakens both arguments.

There might be plenty of other powerful ways to criticize age verification laws.

@Tutanota@mastodon.social

jathanasiou@mastodon.social

@nocci @Tutanota

I appreciate the well-put reply but I have to say I humbly and respectfully disagree with the "trivializing of genocide" angle.

Didn't genocide and fascism start with control? ID Checks and marks on people's arms, and monitoring and "removal" of opinions different to the state's? First peacefully, with some half-reasonable excuse "immigrants/<others> threaten our quality-of-life" and then violent suppression.

1/2

kgmadee2@mathstodon.xyz

@nocci @Tutanota absolutely not. While this is about the logistics side of it, the abductions and killing are already carried out in e.g. the US (see up this thread!)

jathanasiou@mastodon.social

@nocci @Tutanota

The web is too big in 2026. Controlling it is not much different to controlling what goes on in the streets.

We've already heard rumors of the UK government using these "web ID checks" to censor wikipedia and news/posts regarding #Palestine and #israel

This IS how it starts, it's just on the digital space now.

2/2

nocci@punk.cyber77.de

@jathanasiou@mastodon.social
I think we agree on the substance: digital surveillance infrastructure DOES enable authoritarianism, and we're seeing it happen with the UK law. Your concerns about control mechanisms have merit.

Where I'd still push back: Niemöller's poem carries specific weight because it's about genocide. We can call out authoritarian patterns—ID checks, surveillance, censorship—without invoking the Holocaust. That reference should be reserved for contexts that actually approach that scale.

Let's respectfully agree to disagree on the specific comparison. That said, your points about the UK and the potential for censorship via ID gates are valid and worrying. That is definitely a fight worth fighting—I just prefer different rhetoric to fight it.

@Tutanota@mastodon.social

nocci@punk.cyber77.de

@kgMadee2@mathstodon.xyz

I already made my stance clear:

@Tutanota@mastodon.social

RE: https://punk.cyber77.de/notes/ahklg4paq2f809e1

cejjacobs@mastodon.social

@Tutanota the other day reporting on Roblox (game platform) some people were happy that the platform added age verification by scanning a photo. So voluntarily having children giving their pictures for facial recognition… (the kids were unimpressed. One 12 years old was identified as 16-17, another claimed to have shown a random photo of an adult)

jathanasiou@mastodon.social

@nocci @Tutanota I hear you and yes I understand your stance very much.

It is important in times like these to retain a sense of unity even if we have somewhat different ways to call out and deal with the dangerous, undemocratic powers we face.

elexia@catcatnya.com

@nocci @Tutanota yeah I agree. this is bad, but it's not the Holocaust.

nocci@punk.cyber77.de

@elexia@catcatnya.com
exactly - thx for confirmation

@Tutanota@mastodon.social

gokushrm@mastodon.social

@Tutanota I'm happy.. I'll start using simple phone or smartphone with minimum services or apps with custom rom.. ️Atleast it ll give me full time to hangout with my people locally.

tonanio@mastodon.social

@Tutanota The reality is that to fight disinformation, misingotmation and scams, only ID verification will work IF and it's a big if, cannot be controlled by governments and corporations, plus the "fake accounts" and bot farms are locked out of Internet, especially social media.
And it ain't going to be good if governments take the lead on developing the solutions.

mightbecrazy@app.wafrn.net

no way the app i always see when i open f-droid is on wafrn(well, mastadon but i dont care. my point is i didnt expect to see it THERE yk)

superboom12s@mastodon.social

@art_histories @Tutanota

Well, can't deny that I absolutely hate social media like that, as they only do care for their gains and not for their users at all, look at Facebook (not only but as an example), who consciously advertises scams and misinformation...

However, I do think regulation is not a solution entirely, I believe that education is way more important, as too much regulation leads to less freedom and people not knowing to manage themselves when they get able to.

imgoneinpeace@mastodon.social

@Tutanota I can't say what I think without being blocked. There is no freedom to speak unless you are a fascist.

tutanota@mastodon.social

@nocci Thank you very much for your feedback and for sharing your stance on this. We agree that this poem could be misinterpreted in such a way, and that is definitely not something we intended. However, in the English-speaking world it is commonly used today to speak up against increasing surveillance tendencies, and that's what we are doing here. We are sorry if this did not come across clear enough and will review future posts more critically.

denisalexclopo@mastodon.social

@Tutanota nope. It's good that adult sites are locked behind age verification. The harder it is to access that rubbish, the better.
The issues are all the others, yes.

jdb_env@mastodon.social

@Tutanota

Thank you for this post

@LDH_Fr
@LaQuadrature

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Age verification is spreading like cancer.