I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now.
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
Who is the "we" in this case?
Community owners and managers?
Somebody else?Because forums still exist, they've never gone away. So if people are using Discord instead of a forum, they've likely got a reason for doing that. So before yelling that they need to expose their communities to the open web, I wouldn't like to know why they chose not to in the first place?
Don't you want to know?
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
@killyourfm The great thing about forums is, that they never really went away. Most of the folks on the internet just got lured in by the promise of "easier" and more convenient platforms. Plus the old culture of "use the search function" and "just google it" really poisoned forum culture for most of the folks. Which in turn really facilitated the rise of people pleasing AI-Bots as search engine replacements. Fun thing: I recently asked the same question as you in a friends discord server.
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
@killyourfm to avoid having to make a new account on every forum you want to post on, it would be cool to have an ActivityPub Single Sign On system. Another idea (which I believe Discourse has already?) is to implement ActivityPub in the forums directly, so that you can post on any forum from your main one.
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
@killyourfm However I fully agree on your sentiment on discussions and knowledge needing to be again search- and discoverable on the open web in lieu to them being hosted on closed platforms. I am insanely grateful to everyone still maintaining proper documentation and searchable forums with actual knowledgable people providing insights there instead of machine-yes-mans.
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
@killyourfm I'm still wondering: why not have both, a public forum that's also accessible through a client that has chatrooms and voice channels for that community built-in?
It's all web tech anyway, literally nothing is stopping anyone from implementing things this way. We can have our cake and eat it too. How did we end up in this mess, with Discord enshittified but no properly working, comprehensive alternative (which isn't "go back to have 5 different apps").
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@killyourfm I'm still wondering: why not have both, a public forum that's also accessible through a client that has chatrooms and voice channels for that community built-in?
It's all web tech anyway, literally nothing is stopping anyone from implementing things this way. We can have our cake and eat it too. How did we end up in this mess, with Discord enshittified but no properly working, comprehensive alternative (which isn't "go back to have 5 different apps").
@Natanox @killyourfm just have a chatroom embed on a page of the forum, like one of those web IRC clients. I remember seeing some forums doing this already many years ago.
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@Natanox @killyourfm just have a chatroom embed on a page of the forum, like one of those web IRC clients. I remember seeing some forums doing this already many years ago.
@killyourfm @gianmarcogg03 Doing it with an app (even if it's just Electron) does give you better ways to handle UI/UX though, especially when it comes to Voice channels and navigation on touch devices. I don't think the old style of forums gonna cut it.
I don't understand why 99% of all so-called Discord-alternatives do not get the damn voice channels right anyway (or just ignore that feature entirely). They're a crucial element, and WebRTC isn't dark magic anymore.
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
@killyourfm@layer8.space its not the same usecase
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
@killyourfm It’s amazing to see how issues that have essentially been solved decades ago were thrown out instead of refined. Usenet was federated from the get-go, FidoNet as well. The UX was challenging for casual users though.
The issue is the same everywhere in OSS tech: it’s dominated by engineers, not designers and UI/UX experts. They work for commercial entities because their expertise is valued there. Try working as a capable UX designer with OSS engineers and you’ll see what I mean.
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
@killyourfm One of my local online news orgs just launched a forum. They mentioned how we are overwhelmed with social media nowadays and it’s a good time to return to the humble forum.
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
@killyourfm maybe something like Discourse could be workable since it’s more like forums
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
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@killyourfm to avoid having to make a new account on every forum you want to post on, it would be cool to have an ActivityPub Single Sign On system. Another idea (which I believe Discourse has already?) is to implement ActivityPub in the forums directly, so that you can post on any forum from your main one.
@gianmarcogg03 oh that's genius, and would definitely solve one of the most annoying paper cuts!
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
@killyourfm Yes! I'm all for bringing forums back.
But forums have their problems, too. (Even when they're not shiny, infinite-scrolling, Web 2.0 nightmares.)
No system is resilient against an attacker with sufficient motivation and resources, but (as Prokopetz has pointed out over on Tumblr) it didn't take all *that* much motivation or resources for one troll to render a self-hosted indie forum completely inoperable. That's part of why the big socials took over in the first place.
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@killyourfm @myTerminal I have arrived at the conclusion that if someone I know enough for that kind of communication suggests a new *sensible* platform I am not already using, that is fine, I will use it. You have taken up Session or SimpleX: Cool. Let's do that. Even between Signal, Matrix, Delta Chat, Nextcloud Talk and Threema, I have a pretty good idea where people are. Of course, all this is for private communications, so not on a huge scale.
@mjj @killyourfm I have a similar approach where I'm almost everywhere my people are (unfortunately including #WhatsApp), but for the ones like us, it means carrying a sizable baggage for something that most people: (a) get done with only one platform which is often WhatsApp, and (b) do not even have to think/worry about.
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@mjj @killyourfm I have a similar approach where I'm almost everywhere my people are (unfortunately including #WhatsApp), but for the ones like us, it means carrying a sizable baggage for something that most people: (a) get done with only one platform which is often WhatsApp, and (b) do not even have to think/worry about.
@myTerminal @mjj That mental "baggage" is real. I have to stay on Messenger for my aunt and grandmother. I have to stay on WhatsApp for 2 of my friends. Etc...
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I know this #Discord nonsense has a lot of people searching for alternatives (like Matrix, Stoat, etc), and those alternatives have a chance to shine right now. BUT we need to go back to discussions and knowledge being searchable on the open web!
I say bring back the forums. It's time.
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@killyourfm Back to forums? Yes, please!!! I used to write in forums, found friends there, until that damned FB killed them all. I lost so many contacts (I never joined FB) and miss people and discussions about special topics ...
@SusanneDoering@zirk.us @killyourfm@layer8.space
This!
I ran two forums for special interests but Discord, Facebook and all the other "services" killed it bc ppl were keen to go into jail -
N nocci@punk.cyber77.de shared this topic
