An important PSA for people who are active on #Bluesky and who, upon hearing that the ICE account was officially verified, are saying: "I will just block it."
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@u_urban personally, i'm in a better neighborhood already (fedi), but sadly a large number of artists/makers/etc are now solely on bluesky (or are on other awful sites like Instagram).
It's partially sunk cost fallacy, because i'd rather not lose out on following these folks, but also how am I supposed to "force their hand" to move...
I have no financial connection to staying on Bluesky, but a social one (same with Instagram, you won't get nearly as much info on local events if you're not on there.....)
Change is hard idk sorry for the ramt
Thank you, your repeat is welcome!
One thing doesn't fit to everyone.
Main thing is, to be concious about moving in dangerous territorry and as far as possible, avoid it.
#UnplugTrump is a long way to go, but time is running!
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The very same applies to the Fediverse, by the way: When blocking someone, that information is relayed to the instance where the blocked account is hosted. While this is not typically publicly visible, malicious instances know who blocked some of their members and can of course use that information.
(We internally used the amount of blocks as a hint to which local account to investigate, but it‘s at present not worth the hassle.)
@Saupreiss@pfalz.social @_elena@mastodon.social BTW: is it relayed to the instance right away, or only when the blocked person attempts to reply or otherwise use a feature that is to be blocked?
Either way, blocks are harmful specifically because they tell the person they're blocked. Which is why I strongly prefer mutes instead. -
@_elena I will never understand this decision. I’ve seen people say it’s just due to how ATProtocol works. But surely there’s a way they could have implemented blocks and have them private.
@bastardsheep @_elena Block by its nature cannot be private. It has an easily testable outcome.
Frankly, for a dedicated individual, block on mastodon is no different from mute with a ritual. From what I can find (without checking code), mastodon’s implementation ignores ActivityPub recommendation on not sharing block activities.
The difference here is in magnitude. Mastodon doesn’t share the list contents with the whole wild world. Only with the one you really don’t care to share it with.
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@bastardsheep @_elena Block by its nature cannot be private. It has an easily testable outcome.
Frankly, for a dedicated individual, block on mastodon is no different from mute with a ritual. From what I can find (without checking code), mastodon’s implementation ignores ActivityPub recommendation on not sharing block activities.
The difference here is in magnitude. Mastodon doesn’t share the list contents with the whole wild world. Only with the one you really don’t care to share it with.
@bastardsheep @_elena And immediate self-correction, it doesn’t violate requirement, but a recommendation:
> SHOULD NOT - This phrase, or the phrase "NOT RECOMMENDED" mean that there may exist valid reasons in particular circumstances when the particular behavior is acceptable or even useful, but the full implications should be understood and the case carefully weighed before implementing any behavior described with this label.
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@nazokiyoubinbou Just a note for the Fediverse = paradise adepts: I'm regularly blocking and if possible reporting Maga propaganda even on Mastodon. You can get evil people *everywhere*.
The question is how much you can protect yourself or if such attempts are defederated or suspended.
Here, the Fediverse is better because human moderators. But most people don't know that difference. And would Mastodon be prepared if the ICE opens an account?@NatureMC @u_urban @_elena I suspect most of Mastodon would end up blocking the entire instance with ICE on it, but I can't say for sure. And I think that would be something the servers themselves would do, not individual accounts. Perhaps some would be afraid to go that far, but I think the majority would do it.
You are right that the Fediverse is anything but perfect of course. There's only so much human moderators can do in particular. The chief difference is it's ours not some company's
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@Saupreiss@pfalz.social @_elena@mastodon.social BTW: is it relayed to the instance right away, or only when the blocked person attempts to reply or otherwise use a feature that is to be blocked?
Either way, blocks are harmful specifically because they tell the person they're blocked. Which is why I strongly prefer mutes instead.Right away. That instance needs it so that that user cannot see the toots or can reply to it, so of course there is little that could be done differently.
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@nazokiyoubinbou @u_urban @_elena When Donald Trump originally said that he would ban TikTok, where did people begin their migration?
An equivalent to TikTok owned by the Chinese government: RedNote.
The average consumer does not do a lot of thinking, research, or care really.
@shanie @u_urban @_elena Unfortunately, this is exactly what I mean.
I really really wish people would put in just... a minimum effort on things at least... Like, in general. Most people just will not even do the bare minimum. On anything...
I'm not asking for people to nearly OCD-level dig into things every time like the way some of us *cough*me*cough* do, but they could at least do a quick general search and see what people are saying outside their bubble or something...
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An important PSA for people who are active on #Bluesky and who, upon hearing that the ICE account was officially verified, are saying: "I will just block it."
Blocking on Bluesky is NOT PRIVATE: it's very easy to see who is blocking any account by visiting sites that list that information.
I took a screenshot from https://clearsky.app, listing all the accounts that are blocking ICE (I pixelated avatars and usernames for privacy purposes).
The safest bet is to mute (that info is private)
Thank you!
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An important PSA for people who are active on #Bluesky and who, upon hearing that the ICE account was officially verified, are saying: "I will just block it."
Blocking on Bluesky is NOT PRIVATE: it's very easy to see who is blocking any account by visiting sites that list that information.
I took a screenshot from https://clearsky.app, listing all the accounts that are blocking ICE (I pixelated avatars and usernames for privacy purposes).
The safest bet is to mute (that info is private)
I would also like to note that ICE is not a normal government agency. In my opinion, a normal government agency should be active on social media, at least if its goal is to be a relevant network. However, there are plenty of cases where state police have arrested ICE "officers" for acting without legal basis in their states. It is therefore not a normal agency, but an organization that acts unlawfully and is only protected by state authority, bypassing the American legal system.
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An important PSA for people who are active on #Bluesky and who, upon hearing that the ICE account was officially verified, are saying: "I will just block it."
Blocking on Bluesky is NOT PRIVATE: it's very easy to see who is blocking any account by visiting sites that list that information.
I took a screenshot from https://clearsky.app, listing all the accounts that are blocking ICE (I pixelated avatars and usernames for privacy purposes).
The safest bet is to mute (that info is private)
@_elena @mayintoronto I deleted BlueSky last Sept it not worth
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@sloanlance not just ICE but also 4Chan-minded bad actors that may harass users blocking gov accounts
@_elena
Ok. Makes sense, I guess. It's good to know the risks.PS: I remember the days when 4Chan was just silly crap.
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@u_urban @_elena I feel like all the people who went to Bluesky because Twitter died and became the rabid zombie X learned precisely nothing. It is inevitable that Bluesky will hurt them too, but they will not go to Mastodon because any of a number of silly reasons they'll fight tooth and nail not to let go of.
I suppose a Redsky will open up and they'll go to it, then it will go bad and then a Puke Green Sky will open up and they'll go to that, and then a Gangrene Sky will open...
There is one thing that Bluesky has and the Fediverse still hasn't fully implemented: shared block lists are still not supported natively by ActivityPub and require external, fragmented implementations. Bluesky has account labeling services that can work on a per-account or per-post basis, and shared lists that can be used as either starter packs or banlists. The latter is still WIP on Mastodon's side, because of the focus on being opt-in. -
An important PSA for people who are active on #Bluesky and who, upon hearing that the ICE account was officially verified, are saying: "I will just block it."
Blocking on Bluesky is NOT PRIVATE: it's very easy to see who is blocking any account by visiting sites that list that information.
I took a screenshot from https://clearsky.app, listing all the accounts that are blocking ICE (I pixelated avatars and usernames for privacy purposes).
The safest bet is to mute (that info is private)
@_elena
What the hell - why would this be public information? Do they WANT to encourage abuse?
@dgoldsmith -
@_elena I'm not sure if blocking the bridge also blocks linked posts. As far as I can tell on my Bsky account the link to your OP that I shared on Bsky still resolves correctly. Maybe blocking the bridge is a different thing. Or I don't know lol.
@hyperreal @_elena Blocking the bridge isn't going to stop links from working because links just work whether the bridge exists or not. Bridgy Fed just makes it so you have one account on, say Mastodon, and it duplicates your posts to Bsky. But links from there to here will work because links are just links.
To illustrate, blocking the bridge to prevent linking to a Mastodon is like blocking Google Maps and thinking that will prevent the postal service from finding your home address.
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@hyperreal @_elena Blocking the bridge isn't going to stop links from working because links just work whether the bridge exists or not. Bridgy Fed just makes it so you have one account on, say Mastodon, and it duplicates your posts to Bsky. But links from there to here will work because links are just links.
To illustrate, blocking the bridge to prevent linking to a Mastodon is like blocking Google Maps and thinking that will prevent the postal service from finding your home address.
@hyperreal Some fun notes about the bridge, if you're bridged, any interactions with other bridged accounts will also show in Bsky. E.g., if you and Elena's accounts were bridged, this entire reply thread would show in Bsky (b/c I am too). Since neither of you are, none of this thread, including my replies, show over there. If I were to quote post them, they would appear on Bsky with just links to each post I'm quoting. If you were bridged and I quote posted, it would show a regular quote post.
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@_elena
What the hell - why would this be public information? Do they WANT to encourage abuse?
@dgoldsmith@xinit@mastodon.coffee @_elena@mastodon.social @dgoldsmith@mastodon.social There is a dedicated docs page answering your questions.
https://docs.bsky.app/blog/block-implementation -
An important PSA for people who are active on #Bluesky and who, upon hearing that the ICE account was officially verified, are saying: "I will just block it."
Blocking on Bluesky is NOT PRIVATE: it's very easy to see who is blocking any account by visiting sites that list that information.
I took a screenshot from https://clearsky.app, listing all the accounts that are blocking ICE (I pixelated avatars and usernames for privacy purposes).
The safest bet is to mute (that info is private)
@_elena I'd also expect US State Security to have other ways of getting the info, whether you block them, delete posts etc
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I closed my account there quite a while back but only de-bridged today. I'm sad to no longer see posts from certain people I followed but overall I feel a whole lot better.
@grb090423
>I'm sad to no longer see posts from certain people I followed (...)You can follow bridged accounts even without your account itself being bridged.
Following a bridge is simply a opt-in to federate your posts to Bluesky and its users
@_elena @hyperreal -
@grb090423
>I'm sad to no longer see posts from certain people I followed (...)You can follow bridged accounts even without your account itself being bridged.
Following a bridge is simply a opt-in to federate your posts to Bluesky and its users
@_elena @hyperreal -
An important PSA for people who are active on #Bluesky and who, upon hearing that the ICE account was officially verified, are saying: "I will just block it."
Blocking on Bluesky is NOT PRIVATE: it's very easy to see who is blocking any account by visiting sites that list that information.
I took a screenshot from https://clearsky.app, listing all the accounts that are blocking ICE (I pixelated avatars and usernames for privacy purposes).
The safest bet is to mute (that info is private)
@_elena Not that I approve of bsky's design choices, their decision to make blocks public is very crypto-coded. Unsurprising since the designers are basically a bunch of coiners.
But also I'd like to remind everyone that all of your posts, reposts, and likes on social media that are anti-ICE or anti-Trump are also very public. So like, be aware of your threat models, certainly. But let's also be realistic and not worry about the pennies when many of us are visibly carrying many pounds.
