I have had a very silly thought on my mind the past few days…
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I have had a very silly thought on my mind the past few days…
Assume somehow, either through a tribunal or a revolution once the war ends and economical desperation sets in, that #Russia gets de-Putinised after the war and somehow manages to democratise (despite it not being in 2/2 of the other super powers’ interest).
Could it then be rehabilitated and welcomed into the #EU - or is it too hated, too big, too broken, too ingrained in the past decades of militarism for it to work?
@o_O The process of integration would, probably, take decades.
Meanwhile there's a chance for some mutual trust to get built.
So yes, a very hypothetical answer to a very hypothetical question. -
I have had a very silly thought on my mind the past few days…
Assume somehow, either through a tribunal or a revolution once the war ends and economical desperation sets in, that #Russia gets de-Putinised after the war and somehow manages to democratise (despite it not being in 2/2 of the other super powers’ interest).
Could it then be rehabilitated and welcomed into the #EU - or is it too hated, too big, too broken, too ingrained in the past decades of militarism for it to work?
@o_O That’s an interesting question. I think there would have to be a period of reconciliation much like between France and Germany after the WW2 . There are many projects between cities or schools to learn about each other and to prevent such hostilities in the future.
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I have had a very silly thought on my mind the past few days…
Assume somehow, either through a tribunal or a revolution once the war ends and economical desperation sets in, that #Russia gets de-Putinised after the war and somehow manages to democratise (despite it not being in 2/2 of the other super powers’ interest).
Could it then be rehabilitated and welcomed into the #EU - or is it too hated, too big, too broken, too ingrained in the past decades of militarism for it to work?
@o_O the first attempt of Russians to become a democracy ended in disaster and chaos. Then came Putin and turned it authoritarian again, a regime, a dictatorship with fake elections - just for decoration.
I'm not sure, that the Russian people really want democracy. Too many support this image of the "strong man at the helm". All the power in only a few hands. Shared power and taking up responsibility as citizens seem to frighten a lot. -
I have had a very silly thought on my mind the past few days…
Assume somehow, either through a tribunal or a revolution once the war ends and economical desperation sets in, that #Russia gets de-Putinised after the war and somehow manages to democratise (despite it not being in 2/2 of the other super powers’ interest).
Could it then be rehabilitated and welcomed into the #EU - or is it too hated, too big, too broken, too ingrained in the past decades of militarism for it to work?
@o_O It is more than possible. Russia, before Putin's presidency-for-life inauguration, was westernizing.
It's entire military industry, as a consequence of USSR collapse, relied on Western electronics. It relied on western products even before Soviet collapse, which was why they performed enormous military stockpiling, due to the anticipation of total war, as a result on Western products in weapons systems.
Köningsberg was at the forefront of this, but not alone. In time, it will happen. If.
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I have had a very silly thought on my mind the past few days…
Assume somehow, either through a tribunal or a revolution once the war ends and economical desperation sets in, that #Russia gets de-Putinised after the war and somehow manages to democratise (despite it not being in 2/2 of the other super powers’ interest).
Could it then be rehabilitated and welcomed into the #EU - or is it too hated, too big, too broken, too ingrained in the past decades of militarism for it to work?
@o_O In theory yes*. In practice I don't think so as such a large country with almost 150 million people would massively shift the balance of power. Current members would not agree on that.
*if one day decades from now Russia adheres to democratic principles, human rights, and the rule of law. And if they truly adhere to the Copenhagen criteria.
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@o_O In theory yes*. In practice I don't think so as such a large country with almost 150 million people would massively shift the balance of power. Current members would not agree on that.
*if one day decades from now Russia adheres to democratic principles, human rights, and the rule of law. And if they truly adhere to the Copenhagen criteria.
@Pepijn Yes the size is a huge problem. Even with current size differences between countries I hear Swedes complain that we don’t have much say in the EU due to being a small country.
And the danger of such a large country backsliding is very real, as it would give them huge leverage over the rest of the union.
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@o_O the first attempt of Russians to become a democracy ended in disaster and chaos. Then came Putin and turned it authoritarian again, a regime, a dictatorship with fake elections - just for decoration.
I'm not sure, that the Russian people really want democracy. Too many support this image of the "strong man at the helm". All the power in only a few hands. Shared power and taking up responsibility as citizens seem to frighten a lot.@energisch_ To be fair, the path to democracy is rarely very smooth. I think the Weimar republic was Germany’s first attempt? The french revolution was followed by the Reign of Terror and the Napoleonic wars.
That said, a de-Putinised Russia would kind of be in that kind of shift where the culture must adapt quickly to democratic values or risk backsliding again.
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E energisch_@troet.cafe shared this topic
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@energisch_ To be fair, the path to democracy is rarely very smooth. I think the Weimar republic was Germany’s first attempt? The french revolution was followed by the Reign of Terror and the Napoleonic wars.
That said, a de-Putinised Russia would kind of be in that kind of shift where the culture must adapt quickly to democratic values or risk backsliding again.
@o_O true - but this might be easier in a smaller country. Russia is big, a lot of ethnical & cultural & regional differences. A federation with lots of independent regional govs? Might have better chances
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I have had a very silly thought on my mind the past few days…
Assume somehow, either through a tribunal or a revolution once the war ends and economical desperation sets in, that #Russia gets de-Putinised after the war and somehow manages to democratise (despite it not being in 2/2 of the other super powers’ interest).
Could it then be rehabilitated and welcomed into the #EU - or is it too hated, too big, too broken, too ingrained in the past decades of militarism for it to work?
@o_O@mastodon.nu It would likely take at least a decade. For Germany it took 10 years to be allowed to rearm at all, and it joined the EU three years later.
Now, Russia's WW2 crimes have been mostly ignored because everyone was focusing on Hitler. Old memories from Stalin's crimes are coming up now - and the world realizes now that unlike Germany, Russia's punishment for the war crimes has not taken place yet, which did embolden them to what is going on now.
Meanwhile though, Germany is still too weak to stave off its own right wing flare up... can't we finally go and ban the AfD? This is NOT the same as Nazis banning communist parties... -
@o_O true - but this might be easier in a smaller country. Russia is big, a lot of ethnical & cultural & regional differences. A federation with lots of independent regional govs? Might have better chances
@energisch_ yeah, Russia’s official name is the Russian Federation after all… and it has numerous secessionist movements. There’s a lot of theories and speculation out there on what a dissolved Russia could look like. We can dream.
