TL;DR Most EV batteries will last longer than the cars they’re in.
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@jwildeboer huh, so that means a car you leave charged up at home and use maybe once a week or less will degrade its battery fast.
@mirabilos The BMS (Battery Management System) in modern EVs is smart enough to counter that by not going above 80%. It's still a good idea to regularly bring down the charge to below 50% at least, though.
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@mirabilos The BMS (Battery Management System) in modern EVs is smart enough to counter that by not going above 80%. It's still a good idea to regularly bring down the charge to below 50% at least, though.
@jwildeboer that just means one has to buy a battery that’s 5/4 as large as one really needs
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@jwildeboer
Therefore, the batteries will be enshittified to last the duration of the warranty, then degrade swiftly.
No automaker wants their cars to last forever.The cars will degrade in any case. Particularly in areas with winter, salt will cause an ongoing rust problem.
Not to mention that the car computers' wirings will not last forever, either.
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TL;DR Most EV batteries will last longer than the cars they’re in. Battery degradation is at better (meaning: lower) rates than expected. Slow charging is better. Drive EV and don’t worry about your battery.
„Our 2025 analysis of over 22,700 electric vehicles, covering 21 different vehicle models, confirms that overall, modern EV batteries are robust and built to last beyond a typical vehicle’s service life.“
Good news…
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@bob_zim I think I do recall that, actually, but to be fair, anyone who ever tried to keep a ghetto blaster going on NiMH D-cells knows that was doomed from the start.
@jpaskaruk @bob_zim @jwildeboer my boomnox had 8 and drained them pretty fast. Lol
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@dalias many newer cars manufactured in the past 20+ years will not make it to 25 years due to electronics failing (capacitors and mosfets are typical candidates), regardless of being powered by ICE or EV.
@jwildeboer See: "atrociously bad quality of cars". This wouldn't be a problem if swapping out the electronics were trivial, but when you have an intentionally locked-down shit Android device on wheels rather than a proper car...
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TL;DR Most EV batteries will last longer than the cars they’re in. Battery degradation is at better (meaning: lower) rates than expected. Slow charging is better. Drive EV and don’t worry about your battery.
„Our 2025 analysis of over 22,700 electric vehicles, covering 21 different vehicle models, confirms that overall, modern EV batteries are robust and built to last beyond a typical vehicle’s service life.“
@jwildeboer What about cold days? We recently had about 3 weeks around -40, usually get about 2 weeks a year below -30 C and months of -20 C. In this climate, must people don't have a garage, and those who do generally don't heat them. Any insight?
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@jwildeboer yes. Data doesn't go that far.
@renard @jwildeboer battery degradation slows down over the lifetime. Although this probably depends on the chemistry.
BEVs typically have lower maintenance, so I don't see why 20yr can't be matched. If (e.g.) 70% State-of-Health is acceptable 20-years in, i guess it's still a viable car to drive.
However, I'm not sure why "20 years" is a metric to hold up against. Is that primarily a financial consideration? Worded differently: Would you buy younger for the same price?
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@renard @jwildeboer battery degradation slows down over the lifetime. Although this probably depends on the chemistry.
BEVs typically have lower maintenance, so I don't see why 20yr can't be matched. If (e.g.) 70% State-of-Health is acceptable 20-years in, i guess it's still a viable car to drive.
However, I'm not sure why "20 years" is a metric to hold up against. Is that primarily a financial consideration? Worded differently: Would you buy younger for the same price?
@dynom 20 years is a weirdly special metric, considering that EVs have not been generally available 20 years ago and the progress has been impressive in the past 10 years. But hey, petrolheads gonna petrol, I guess
@renard@equestria.social -
@dalias many newer cars manufactured in the past 20+ years will not make it to 25 years due to electronics failing (capacitors and mosfets are typical candidates), regardless of being powered by ICE or EV.
@jwildeboer @dalias I wonder how much it varies between companies - like if traditional manufacturers are still at least trying to build to last (within the limits of designs these days), while more techbro-derived manufacturers lean harder into planned obsolescence to try to impose short upgrade cycles..
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@jwildeboer @dalias I wonder how much it varies between companies - like if traditional manufacturers are still at least trying to build to last (within the limits of designs these days), while more techbro-derived manufacturers lean harder into planned obsolescence to try to impose short upgrade cycles..
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@jwildeboer What about cold days? We recently had about 3 weeks around -40, usually get about 2 weeks a year below -30 C and months of -20 C. In this climate, must people don't have a garage, and those who do generally don't heat them. Any insight?
@newstik @jwildeboer It must not be too large a problem. Nearly all new vehicles sold in Norway are EVs.
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@jwildeboer that just means one has to buy a battery that’s 5/4 as large as one really needs
@jwildeboer SoC limit usually has to be set by the user, BMS does not do this automatically. However @mirabilos your point is invalid. The typical daily range that is driven is 20km or less. So you don't need to charge up to 100% all the time. Just as almost nobody always leaves a petrol car with 100% fuel level in the garage every day. And if you are going on a long trip, there is no harm to charge up to 100%. Just don't do it every time and leave it in that state and you'll be fine.
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@newstik @jwildeboer It must not be too large a problem. Nearly all new vehicles sold in Norway are EVs.
@JYeo18 @jwildeboer Yes because they are massively subsidized there compared to conventional vehicles. In that environment, I'd happily buy a car that is guaranteed to go up in flames after a decade. That doesn't translate to other parts of the North.
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@JYeo18 @jwildeboer Yes because they are massively subsidized there compared to conventional vehicles. In that environment, I'd happily buy a car that is guaranteed to go up in flames after a decade. That doesn't translate to other parts of the North.
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TL;DR Most EV batteries will last longer than the cars they’re in. Battery degradation is at better (meaning: lower) rates than expected. Slow charging is better. Drive EV and don’t worry about your battery.
„Our 2025 analysis of over 22,700 electric vehicles, covering 21 different vehicle models, confirms that overall, modern EV batteries are robust and built to last beyond a typical vehicle’s service life.“
@jwildeboer I bet that study jinxed it for everybody.
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"Quick Summary
Frequency of Fires: EVs are far less likely to catch fire than ICE vehicles—20 times less according to Swedish data—despite high-profile media coverage of EV fire incidents."
https://ev-lectron.com/blogs/blog/ev-fires-vs-ice-fires-safety-comparison-and-analysis
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@jwildeboer SoC limit usually has to be set by the user, BMS does not do this automatically. However @mirabilos your point is invalid. The typical daily range that is driven is 20km or less. So you don't need to charge up to 100% all the time. Just as almost nobody always leaves a petrol car with 100% fuel level in the garage every day. And if you are going on a long trip, there is no harm to charge up to 100%. Just don't do it every time and leave it in that state and you'll be fine.
@jwildeboer @acidicX yes but the use case I’m eyeing (due to circumstances) is daily nothing, and very occasionally either 10 km or 80 km
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@jwildeboer @acidicX yes but the use case I’m eyeing (due to circumstances) is daily nothing, and very occasionally either 10 km or 80 km
@jwildeboer @acidicX and Inhad been hoping to get the option of a very small vehicle for that
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TL;DR Most EV batteries will last longer than the cars they’re in. Battery degradation is at better (meaning: lower) rates than expected. Slow charging is better. Drive EV and don’t worry about your battery.
„Our 2025 analysis of over 22,700 electric vehicles, covering 21 different vehicle models, confirms that overall, modern EV batteries are robust and built to last beyond a typical vehicle’s service life.“
@jwildeboer
This is truly very interesting!
